Word on the street: stogies and vino
2007 July 5
An in the know tipster sent the following two tidbits our way today:
There’s a new cigar bar in Harlem. It opened a few weeks ago. It’s on Madison Ave. between 118 – 119th Sts. Check it out if you have a chance. It’s a BYO . . . since, they cannot acquire a liquor license.
I was there last Friday. They had somewhat of an informal opening. The official opening was on Sat. 6/30.Renaissance Cigar Emporium
212-348-7028
And as a follow up to a Curbed tip back at the beginning of the year, Harlem Vintage’s wine bar opening has been pushed back to September ‘07. It was originally slated to open this summer.
Harlem Vintage is planning on opening their wine bar in Sept. I was
there on Sat. 6/30. One of the salesgirls told me.
Stumble It!
There is nothing positive for anyone to promote and or bring attention to a bar who’s specific activity kills.
Is UF fair enough to allow expose of the other side of the story? Oh, I forget, is smoking a cigar supposed to be something upscale? Bad job UF, this is little different than promoting unprotected sex.
Great, now we’re promoting ways to kill ourselves, we’ve really come a long way. Congratulations UF.
http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/129/2/169
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Tobacco/cigars
man oh man. you just cant get a break on this site.
I say bravo UF for putting this out there.
#1, what a silly and typically hysterically uninformed post. Non-habitual cigar smoking, ie: less than 1 a day, does not significantly raise the risk for cancer. Please educate yourself before you spout off the first 2 links you found in google.
Maybe you should read the second link you posted a little closer, you know, where they state that the study only observed cigar smokers who smoke DAILY. Its right there in the second paragraph…
“The researchers noted that cigar smoking causes serious health risks for daily cigar smokers”.
Now, here are some links which you all might find interesting…
http://www.cigardiary.com/index.php?module=pagemaster&PAGE_user_op=view_page&PAGE_id=30
http://www.cigargroup.com/faq/health/
Further, I know it may be hard for you to believe but GASP! Some of us smoke an occasional cigar because it gives us pleasure and because we enjoy iy, not because we are trying to portray the air of being big willy. The tradition of cigar smoking goes way back and is a world away from cigarettes which are constructed with only addictiveness in mind. Yet they are always, and unfairly, lumped together.
Finally, god forbid we are sometimes allowed a space to partake in smoking a cigar. Its not like we are everywhere blowing smoke in your face and annoying you. I can count on one hand the places in this city where one can go to smoke a cigar. I have no problem with bars being smoke free, in fact I was for that legislation, but opposing a spot whose only customers will be those who want to smoke a cigar reeks of the kind of nanny mentality that I despise. You dont like it, good dont patronize the establishment, but why the F do you care If I do it.
#3 – Pathetic, trying to spin, and legitimize cigar smoking? Trying to diminish Cigar’s impact?
-black have been historically exploited by industry in all sorts of ways. the spirits industry targets black nabes with high alcohol content malt liquor for example, Black mags have lots of alcohol and cigarette ads, even this crazy heavily sugar content soft drinks are targeted to kids. It’s all be presented as “not harmful”, not at all, blah blah blah.
There’s a direct link between food marketing and childhood obesity, a major problem in Harlem.
http://www.prb.org/Articles/2006/TheNeglectedLinkFoodMarketingandChildhoodObesityinPoorNeighborhoods.aspx
So Black nabes are targeted with all sorts of unhealthy products by industry, unhealthy fast food, and the health is rather poor across the board.
Now you want to give the “Greenlight” and all is Okay with Cigar smoking? A Single Puff? How dumb do you think Black people are? Seriously, there is nothing healthy about anyone taking a single puff of a cigar, cigarette, or anything.
It’s a bad thing for Black people’s health, wish it was not coming to Harlem, it’s that simple, but you go ahead, you’re a real big shot baller with a cigar and all, I’m very impressed, why I bet you make a whole lotta money, baller that you are.
“cigar smoking is much more lethal than we thought”
Eric Jacobs, American Cancer Society
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/low/health/644837.stm
But Black people, don’t believe what you read, believe industry, after all, all the studies are complete, we know everything there is to know, and this bozo above had given a cigar the healthy nod.
We’re actually justifying our own suicide. Cigar smoking risky? Oh no, No. 3 has all the answers, and while you’re at it, why use a condom? Ever? Since you’re living on the edge, big baller that you are, and the risk are small that you’re damaging your lungs, toss out the condom and go raw dog, why not, the risk are not all that bad.
Supporting, promoting, bringing attention to Cigar smoking is little different than doing the same with unprotected sex,and then trying to diminish the risk.
Pathetic.
#4, I’m all down for the cause and stuff, but I think you’re response was a little over the top and un-necessarily racial.
I heard about this cigar bar from colleague who is an avid cigar smoker.
We’re both Harlemites. I don’t smoke at all, but I was excited to hear that this establishment was opening up. And that’s because it’s another small business being opened by a local entrepreneur.
Also, when you think about it, who are the folks smoking cigars? Most folks I know are generally middle to high income who are making a choice to do so.
With all the advocacy we want and need to do around health issues, we should respect folks ability to make their own decisions. Otherwise, you’re talking about dictating people’s behavior.
It’s not like cigars are being marketed to the young mothers living in public housing like “quarter water”. You and I both know that the market for such an establishment is upscale, high roller types or those who want to be identified as such.
So let’s not play the race card everytime an issue like this comes up. We know the deal as far as how bad stuff gets dumped in communities of color, but in instances like a cigar bar I think we have to respect people’s personal choices.
Are you serious? Unprotected sex, obesity? Stop trying to attack my argument by correlating it with quasi similar yet indefensible positions. Insinuating I am smoking in order to appear baller? Whatever, you have no idea who I am but I can guarantee you nobody would ever accuse me of that I work for a not for profit and dress like a bum). I guess you like to attack the messenger. Classy.
So, thanks for putting a whole bunch of words in my mouth.
I guess Harlem residents who smoke cigars are better off heading downtown and buying cigars from Davidoff (ie: sending their hard earned cash directly to Switzerland).
6, you just demonstrated you don’t “get it”. look at your words, you suggest the only people that would cater the place are current cigar smokers.
Wrong. by placing the cigar den in Harlem, people that never ever before considered venturing downtown might wind up at that place cigar smoking.
Just because they engage in it downtown does not mean it should be available here in Harlem. For example, Harlem would be better of without any OTB outlets. That crap ruins peoples lives more than it helps them, they can keep that crap downtown and Harlem and its citizens would be better off.
The same with the cigar crap, it falls right in line with high risk activity, unprotected sex, gambling (OTB), etc.
Just being real.
It is very unlikely that non cigar smokers would suddenly begin to frequent the place simply because it is in the neighborhood. That’s a pretty absurd statement. Are you suggesting that people become addicted to alcohol as a result of their proximity to a bar??
Shutting down this small local business will not solve underlying socioeconomic problems that plague our society. We live a free society and mandating what people can and cannot do is dictatorial and ineffective- just look at our drug policies. If you want to effect change, then empower people through education and opportunities.
I am not going to argue with you anymore since you are incapable of even considering the fact that MODERATE and infrequent cigar smoking does not significantly increase the risk for disease and is not a scourge on society.
Since you approach the issue from a zero sum standpoint, I am wondering if you are in favor of closing every bar, liquor store, bodega, OTB, hot dog stand, pastry shop, supermarket, coffeeshop, and any other purveyor of anything that may possibly be “unhealthy”?
What the hell, lets put up a wall around Harlem to ensure nothing 100% organic ever gets in. Then once its built we can all try really hard to pretend that the laws of economics don’t apply to our little utopia anymore. This all sounds totally feasible, and it undoubtedly the way to solve all the problems of the urban inner city.
If you are in favor of closing a cigar store for the reasons you mentioned then by extension you are implying all this as well. Forwarding an argument in which you mandate what people can and cannot do has proven over and over again to be a total waste of time while concurrently doing nothing to solve the issues at hand.
Good luck, and “just being real”.
PS-”Just being real” Part 2 -Public policy mandates that nobody is allowed to take illegal drugs. How is that situation working out?
First a caviar and champagne bar that never really launched; now a cigar bar. Sure it is great to add new businesses to the neighborhood, but it would also be great to get some businesses that met the needs of more than a handful of residents.
#1 needs to smoke something stronger than a cigar and chill out.
ha..wow. you guys make a federal case out of just about everything…lol. can people just enjoy their vices? it’s not like a Joe Camel Concert at St Nick’s Park or anything. It’s a cigar shop
Hugo,
Exactly. “It’s a Cigar Shop”. There is no difference in saying those words and saying “It’s a Cigarette Shop” or saying, “It’s a shop that’s in the business of hooking you on a drug – nicotine – who’s product ultimately kills you”.
My point was the absurdity of UF advertising, promoting, and bringing attention to a business that’s in the business of destructing health – and in this case to likely Black people.
We kill ourselves. We make excuses, work to diminish, divert, etc. but the bottom line is tobacco kills you – why is Uptown Flavor pushing a tobacco distributing business?
Explain that without diversion. If UF wants to be part of the chain of killing Black people, that’s fine and their choice, I just thought they were more enlightened to the issue of tobacco.
There’s no excuse, spin, nothing you can say to prop up UF, it’s nothing short of ignorance and ethnic suicide to promote a cigar bar in Harlem.
Just because it exist does not mean UF needs to engage in the promotion of the place. Don’t confuse the issue. UF is choosig to participate in the promotion of a killing activity in Harlem. Explain the wisdom in that.
Anyone here willing to say it’s legit, and fine for UF to push a tobacco parlor? Doing that is participating in the chain of death for Black people. The key to killing Black people is to get ignorant Black people to particpate in their destruction – but fooling them and couching it in a context to where they except it, ya’ll know how foolish, ignorant, and easy it is to pull the wool over the eyes of Negoes and tell them black is white, and white is black, and up is down, and down is up.
So is UF part of the ignorant Negro culture and mentality? Participating in the pushing of tobacco on Black folk and all.
Higher intelligence and wisdom, higher thinkers don’t engage in the killing of their own, get a clue UF.
If there is one thing that makes my butt itch it is people who prop themselves up on a high horse and attempt to make themselves the moral police. It is condescending and insulting my intelligence. We are adults. This isn’t a school house full of children who don’t yet know right from wrong and it certainly isn’t a church. I read magazines with liquor and cigarette ads. Does that mean I go out and get drunk and smoke every time I read them? The subway has those ads as well as billboards. Give it rest! Let people make their own choices whether they eat meat, smoke or ride motorcycles.
Lack of jobs, lack of educational opportunities, lack adequate health care causes more destitution than nicotine. Bravo UF for promoting a local businesses. As a result, people from within are being empowered.
Wow! Can’t believe the vociferousness of the posters on this topic! And the quick pull of the race card (shouldn’t you hold that in reserve at least until you see what the other players around the table are playing?).
I smoke a cigar about 4 times per year. That’s it. Special occasions. Maybe other people smoke more. Next time I go buy a cigar, am I going to go to the cigar shop around the corner from where I work in Midtown? Or am I going to go to Madison and 119? Because I’m proud of this community and want to see new establishments succeed (which encourages other new establishments – restaurants, clothing shops, nightlife, etc. to open), I’m gonna go to the new cigar shop on Madison.
Bottom line – I earn my salary in Midtown and try to spend it in Harlem. I think that should be the goal. Besides the health concern (you’re not changing any opinions here), I think some of the posters above are way off-base.
ha…so if UF announces a new bar/restaurant it’s promoting the death of blacks and latinos at the hands of alcohol and grease. i get your health concerns guys, just don’t make UF the bad guy for putting out the word on these new places. as for me, poker night’s next week. gonna pick me up a Leon Jimenez.
#1 – Where is your self-righteous, moral outrage about all the fast-food and other fried crap in Harlem? Your arguments are sad and laughable at best. Get over yourself and find a real cause.
thanks, i like a good cigar every once in a while and i live in harlem. instead of going downtown, i can spend the money in my own neighborhood. with the smoking laws as they are, there are so few places to enjoy a good smoke. i don’t see a problem. the bottom line is if you don’t agree with the policy, don’t patronize the establishment.